thread: 2005-11-10 : Open House: Ask a Frequent Question...

On 2006-01-17, Vincent wrote:

Troy: "I'm having a little trouble reconciling IIEE and Fortune mechanics. Fortune in the Middle I think I have down no problem. But what about Fortune at the Begining? Where in the IIEE scheme of things does the roll hit the table? Is it still in the Initiation phase?"

"In the middle" and "at the end" don't position fortune in IIEE at all, in any way, ever, no matter what.

"In the middle" and "at the end" position fortune in the real-world decision-making process. Do you make mechanical decisions after you roll? Then it's fortune in the middle. Do you not? Then it's fortune at the end. (You can't roll before you make any mechanical decisions, since "I'm going to roll" is a mechanical decision, thus there's no fortune at the beginning.)

IIEE is all about the in-game, what the characters are doing at the moment of the roll, what in-game information do you establish before you roll and what do you wait to establish until after you've rolled. What IN-GAME information.

If you're a visual thinker, this might help:

We can come up with examples of FitM vs. FatE at every point in IIEE, if you're still struggling.


This makes TC go "Makes Good Sense..."
I got it now. It's the division between character and player. Makes much better sense now. Thanks a lot! :)

This makes JCL go "I disagree about Fortune in the Beginning."
Anything that is true of all possible states should be ignored when defining the possible states. Since rolling dice *always* involves a decision to roll the dice, that particular decision is irrelevant: you can't decide *not* to roll the dice and still have FitM/FatE, because there wouldn't be any Fortune to discuss in that situation. Therefore, it's irrelevant to Fortune in the Beginning, too. I would say that the relevant mechanical decisions aren't those that affect *whether* you roll, but *how*. Everything you said about FitM and FatE are true: if your decisions boost or diminish your die roll in some way before you've made the roll, that's FatE. If you can boost it afterwards, it's FitM. If you can't modify it at all, it's FitB. However, I tried a FitB system with Troubadours of Verticaille, and that game designs sucks. So my conclusion is that FitB exists, but isn't useful.

This makes VB go "JCL: fair enough."

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